AXSChat Podcast

AXSChat Podcast with Joan Bohan from Disney, Aspen First Movers Fellow and Dyslexia Advocate

February 26, 2021 Antonio Santos, Debra Ruh, Neil Milliken talk Joan Bohan
AXSChat Podcast
AXSChat Podcast with Joan Bohan from Disney, Aspen First Movers Fellow and Dyslexia Advocate
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Show Notes Transcript

Originally from the Los Angeles area, Joan started her career with KPMG before relocating to Paris, France where she embarked on a 25+ year international career with Disney. A seasoned commercial finance executive, with a CPA, she has held leadership roles across a wide range of businesses – from Film Distribution & Acquisitions to Consumer Products & Retail – at both the Regional and local office Market level, working in Paris, London, Amsterdam & Brussels.
In 2016, inspired by her son, Joan launched “Dysnie” a Social Intrapreneur venture geared toward empowering Dyslexic children to unlock their potential through innovative & inclusive product, inspiring content and community engagement. An eye opener and total game changer, Joan is now taking the professional leap into Social Innovation. In 2020, she was awarded a Fellowship from the Aspen Institute focusing on increasing business value and making the world a better place.

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WEBVTT

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Neil Milliken: hello, and welcome to access chat i'm delighted that we're joined today by john bowne Joan is working for Disney in Paris.

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Neil Milliken: and has been responsible for setting up that dis me network focusing on helping find potential for their dyslexic employees and helping people realize that potential, because we know we have potential so welcome john, can you tell us a little bit about.

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Neil Milliken: Who, you are, how you came to take this journey on and what sparked your passion in dyslexia.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: Yes, thanks for having me and thanks for having this conversation, because I am really enthusiastic about dyslexia, but.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: On the on the back of that I am a Disney employee, where I worked for more than 25 years i'm originally from Los Angeles.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: transplanted myself in France, I ended up settling down.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And having having children and one of my children is dyslexic and I learned this early on, when he was about six years old, the age that you that you are when you learn how to read.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And as an American in Paris, I really struggled to get my my brain around what dyslexia was, I was not at all familiar with it and the bits and pieces that I heard.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: are actually quite frightening people in my entourage in France had children or acquaintances that were dyslexic and the stories that I heard were pretty.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: difficult to listen to and you know it's boiled down to the very strict and demanding school system.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: The lack of understanding on the part of everyone, like that, so I really struggled with this, but you know as an American I I you know.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: You know reading English and it's just my you know natural natural way of reading and I came across some pretty fantastic books.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: In English that came out in the United States, talking about dyslexia one of one of those being overcoming dyslexia.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And it talked about a dyslexic brain and how it worked another one dyslexic advantage really focused on the strength side of dyslexia.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And a couple of others, including the dyslexic empowerment plan and.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: You know, I was really amazed to learn the incredible things that I know today about dyslexia that yes, there is.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: A challenge with reading and spelling and writing as a result, but the brain is really set up in such a way that things are processed differently, and so, just like six think differently, which means that there are these creative minds.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: Out of the box thinkers and problem solvers and you know, I was just floored because up until that point I hadn't realized, there were strings In fact the buzz.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: About dyslexia, I think, was rather negative and talked about an implied, maybe even a sub.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: subpar intelligence level, so you know, I was just really excited about that and I wanted my son to be excited about that, and so I really pumped this information.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: up into him and, yes, that was kind of my backdrop and I was like the cheerleader I was a dyslexic cheerleader you know in my household.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And about five years ago, so coming back to that how I got involved in this project, so about five years ago.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: At Disney I pitched an idea about dyslexia empowerment, you know really thought this would be a great opportunity to help change the perception of dyslexia.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: and show the positive side, but also inform people because you know as dyslexics know people don't quite understand it even teachers don't necessarily know what they need to know about dyslexia.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: So it is pretty daunting and you know I thought, if we could tell children with dyslexia.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: was about, then when they became adults, they would be you know less intimidated by that word and maybe even be inspired by the dyslexic colleague or friend that that they came across.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: So I went ahead and put together this proposal that really was harnessing what we did best at Disney you know I wasn't reinventing the wheel, I mean we did product.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: We had experiences we have content, and you know Disney was a rather engaged company with with our communities anyway, so I just went ahead and apply.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: dyslexia in there and really that that got me started and and you know, I was I pitched the the the initiative to the European management team who went ahead and gave me the green light in France and the Netherlands and Belgium.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And Reno from there, we were able to launch a product that was dyslexia, friendly and content and Community engagement.

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Neil Milliken: That sounds great, and I am aware of the challenges for young people in the French education system, because it is very different to the sort of Anglo American approach to education in general but also particularly around.

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Neil Milliken: The approach to dyslexia, and so on, and that there was a distinct lack of tooling, it is a focus on handwriting and all of these things that are all the things that are going to make people disengage with with education so.

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Neil Milliken: So i'm really glad that you, you cheerleading for your own son and for people with dyslexia, in general, and then i'm really interested, also in what the impacts of been the positive impacts have been of your program you know what.

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Neil Milliken: What does it done in terms of bringing together a community of dyslexic and neuro divergent individuals, because it's i'm sure that you know, like many dyslexia often overlaps with other neuro diverging conditions i'm dyslexic and ADHD and Deborah to cuckoo.

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Neil Milliken: So, has it brought more people together and what what have been some of the benefits to to the organization of you doing this.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: Well, you know that's that's a great question because you know it's like this journey has been pretty amazing you know, in itself, to be able to bring something very personal to the company and people see me as a mom and.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: You know, as as maybe a crusader in the dyslexia spot So this was just just an amazing experience, but what I found, and I was not expecting at all is that every time I got up on my soapbox who.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: To explain what dyslexia was and so that's what I would do I would take my my colleagues through dyslexia, this is what it is, this is why you need to know it did you know that dyslexics think out of the box are creative and so i'd be pumping all of these.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: These strengths out there and not to mention these famous faces that are associated with dyslexia right.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: You know from the Richard branson's and you know the different celebrities that we've seen Steven Spielberg and many actors, I mean effect all walks of life and.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: People in the audience that were dyslexic who had never admitted, they were dyslexic came up to me afterwards.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: and told me that they were dyslexic and they finally had the courage to actually say that because they saw something that gave them a badge of honor.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And I mean this was really so heartwarming for me because I had not expected this at all.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And these aren't just anybody in the company, these were people that were part of the management team, so you know just was a case in point of the success.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: factors connected with dyslexia, so that was I say one really amazing thing, and each time I spoke, and I speak, and in our different offices in France and the Netherlands and Belgium, and even different vents that we're connected to the.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: The initiative same thing people coming up to me, telling you they're dyslexic and the other thing is, I think that people you know saw that.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: That well as a company, you know we're able to take a social issue and connect it with the business.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And you know that was another thing that was really eye opening to me becomes you know, up until that point, it was just kind of business as usual great business as usual obviously Disney has really a great offering right.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: But that we could actually even go further than that, with our messaging and our products.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And so it really got you know me thinking that we could actually do more than that, in terms of social innovation, but other people were also sparked.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And came forward with ideas that were impactful so i'm not necessarily in the disability space, although there were there were some.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: But you know, the more you talk about these types of initiatives and more people start thinking and that's frankly how I got started, I had no intention of.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: Even submitting an idea until I heard somebody talk about an idea that they had done that, at impact and I got to thinking what could I do, what can I do so, you know you just take one, so that the whole speaking about about these initiatives.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: Really, I think, led to this domino effect of others coming coming up with with similar ideas, and I mean, I really do think that the perception, at least in the offices that I spoken has changed about dyslexia.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And I think you know that's, the only thing that i've done that's enough.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And you know I think there's another.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: point to be made on the consumer side, so in France example we did a range of books with tasha tasha has one of our big licensees and we did a range of beginner books called.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: Just whole nine yards, so I learned to read and especially diesel, it was dyslexia spec dyslexia friendly special version and.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: You know it's really easy to go to Amazon and have a look at those books and look at the comments that you're seeing from the parents are saying oh it last my child was reading.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: In Disney for doing that, so you can see that the the impact is far reaching and that it also warms my heart and.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: We did some content in the same story had children going on to YouTube where our content was sitting.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And, and you know chiming in misspelling things saying i'm dyslexic so they were finally you know, had the courage and maybe the prior to say that that they were dyslexic as well, so.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: it's really touched a lot of areas i'm just saying that the last way that we've connected with the Community on this.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And you know, these things are planning that's the other beauty of doing a project like this, is that you just kind of go with it and insert some ideas kind of crop up.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: I had a mother come up to me after I did a speaking engagement about it.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: In France, about the project, and she said, could you can you take my my son and he's 13 he needs to do a week in the in the in a company as part of the the school program which they have to do in France is called 1000 also please.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And he says he's dyslexic and he's just so you know so down and he would love to be able to do this at Disney.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And so I was able to talk to my HR department and get this boy in our little programming is only open to employees at the time.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: and got him involved and then that led to every year twice a year, we have you know the employees of our of our of our cast members, as we call ourselves.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: involved in this program but also we opened up to this dyslexic children, and you know I mentioned that.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: Some executives came back to me to tell me that they were dyslexic well, I was able to pair them up during a little one to one.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And so that they could not only see this great Disney thing that we were doing, but also to meet one of their own, who was accomplished working for the Walt Disney company, and that was something that I hadn't even planned and boom, you know it just kind of took off and happened.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): yeah it's I think that you, you bring up so many good points I want to say you mentioned a Richard Branson.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): He did a story that I actually read in the delta magazine I forget what it's called but in he said that his deck dyslexia almost killed him.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): And what happened was he was jumping out of an airplane and he was knew he had just started doing this, and he pulled the wrong chord because it has dyslexia.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): Luckily, there was an instructor near, and so they helped correct it too they didn't die, but he considers dyslexia really his.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): You know, is superhuman strength, the superheroes strength, but Neil was one of the first people that I met that really came out big having dyslexia, and really owning it and.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): I also know that Disney has done a lot around the world, to make sure that we all can experience the magic I had mentioned off the air, but that my partner Richard.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): streit's as a former Disney imagineer he worked for Disney for 15 years and bill mini theme parks and still when he talks about Disney he says we we.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): it's like you know, I think, once you fall in love with Disney and you're a cast Member you're always a cast Member but it, so I really liked some of the creative.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): Disability inclusion efforts that Disney was making with here in the States and all over the world, but.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): I also think that the reason why your work is so important and people like you and the rest of us all the stuff that we're all doing is that.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): You know, sometimes when children are learning, you know and and they realize they're different and the way we're teaching does not really help them learn.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): Then they end sometimes society often society turns it on them and you're broken and you're bad and you know, Neil Come on, you need to apply yourself and you need to do this and.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): I certainly was not diagnosed with either one of these things as a child in the first place, women, girls were not being diagnosed boys weren't being.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): much older, but at the same time, then we see only boys being diagnosed so it's it's a very interesting thing progress, but it is unfortunate that still.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): When we're educating individuals with dyslexia, whether it's known or not known and it's often not known.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): The person is attacked well, if you would apply yourself well if you were in it's always you that's broken, and I think that's very damaging to society, because what we do know.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): Is that dyslexia, as you said, very eloquently Joan dyslexics are very creative they're very innovative they think differently, which is what corporations and.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): and employers want they want those innovators and I do think it's important to note that 65% of all entrepreneurs have dyslexia.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): I mean, this is not a minority group, this is a large group of very talented individuals and dyslexia is like everything else.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): it's honor range, so I do want to applaud you for saying wait a minute, how can I make a difference, I mean that's why we started access chat.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): How can we contribute we're not paid anything we have these wonderful supporters and stuff of our.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): program, but we did it because we knew this is one way to bring the Community, which is a gigantic community, if you look about look at the community of people with disabilities and often, unfortunately.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): This and we're working hard on this point, but this is often not a club that people want to join, I remember when my daughter was born.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): Four months later, she was diagnosed with down syndrome and.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): And my first reaction was my daughter does not have down Center no she doesn't so it's like one thing that we are trying to do, and then people like you leaders like you making a difference is making sure that we really, really can.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): Be proud of, who we are and really let be very honest about our lived experience, so we can add value to society and so.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): I just really applaud all the work that you've done to the all of the work that Disney has continued to do.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): To make sure we all can have a magical experience you know we're we're guests we're not customers, we I love how Disney sticks to their brand and their theme of let's all have a magical experience so.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): I just wanted to turn it over to you and I know Antonio has a question, so I will go on mute.

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Antonio Santos: Doing.

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Antonio Santos: Not that long ago, and a friend of mine in Ireland has a young kid was telling me a similar story of discovery that he had a kid with the guilt and the lack of support so even if what happened to you happened a few years ago, I guess, this is something that is happening today is not.

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Antonio Santos: and probably parents of children's they this hour are in this situation might realize well I don't know what to do so, what can we learn from your experience and from your journey, for those who are certainly in your situation right now.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: yeah I know it's true that even if there's a lot of great photos out there are interesting groups that have cropped up over the years, the books that talk about the strength and.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: People you know you know, like us out there kind of pushing the good narrative I mean it's still a struggle and I think it's going to take a generation before the.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: Schools sort of you know, get get get with the program because it's not the problem as as Deborah side with it with the person it's really the system.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: that's not designed it's not inclusive enough right, and you know if I look at the products that we just did with Disney as a side, I mean those products are inclusive if we made all books.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: dyslexia friendly, we would make them inclusive we wouldn't have to worry about that so there's a lot of work to be done so, in the meantime.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: What I would say to parents is that you need to start picking up clues as to where your where your child is on the strength side which what areas do they really do well in.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: Are they good at legos are they good at storytelling and are they good at sports.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: Do they draw really well and these other sort of skills that they conclude you into their strengths.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And then get them in these these extracurriculars and get those develops those skills develop because that's going to help with their self esteem, you know, half the battle, but dyslexia is self esteem.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And you know you have people telling you that you can't.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: But you know you know that you're really good here, and you can think in your mind you think I know I can I don't feel stupid Why am I not able to do this.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: So you know it is a bit confusing, but if at least you can get them on there on the road to some areas that were they're really excelling in.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: You know that's good, I think that you need to inform them as well about all of these great success stories that and, in fact, that they're coming from all walks of life.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: All different disciplines, you know from writers to rocket scientist and people in the entertainment industry.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: Working in corporations, you know, like us, so it really it doesn't there's no limit whatsoever, and you know what I really find.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: exciting it's kind of touches on what Deborah said, is that you know dyslexics have those 21st century skills that corporations are seeking I mean there was an excellent report put out by Ernst and Young.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: A couple of years ago that really outlines all of these and how they just really pair up with with really the skill side or the strength side of dyslexia so.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: So yeah that's that's what I would say to parents and support groups are good, and I would recommend that parents do what I did.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: Try to figure out how their companies could make their services and products dyslexia friendly.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: Because, in the end you'll create awareness and you will also probably get a support group off the ground and an important thing to mention at all this.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: Is that dyslexia touches at least one out of 10 in the US, they talk about one out of five.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: So that means that people need to know what dyslexia is, at the end of the day, you know, we need to tell everybody about it because there's the workforce it's impacted employees customers, etc, so you know I would say, think big about this.

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Neil Milliken: and for the support that I think that you talked about your management team and the number of senior managers that had.

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Neil Milliken: come up to you after you talked.

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Neil Milliken: and explain that they're dyslexic now, obviously with invisible disabilities, it does take some courage to.

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Neil Milliken: To come and talk about this stuff because we have this stigma around conditions where we basically were considered to be stupid or lazy or a dealer 10 K or all of the above, various different points, and so, of course, if you're doing okay and you're finding ways to cope you hide it.

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Neil Milliken: So what i'm interested to know is, because I am passionate about this and I believe that i've had to role model, and it was incumbent on me, as someone in the space that I talk about it openly and always.

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Neil Milliken: But for a long time within my organization I complained that I was the only you know senior manager.

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Neil Milliken: With a disability in the organization and we know there are a lot so did you after those tools get people coming forward because we, we now have a an SVP in the UK that actually.

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Neil Milliken: said actually dyslexia is part of my success, you know, is the reason i'm successful and and again having multiple senior managers start to talk about this is changing the Culture has it has that been a result, one of the results of you.

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Neil Milliken: You going around and talking and and starting this network.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: You know I think depends on the culture and where you're from in Europe.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: I think the Anglo Saxon community is a little bit more open to being you know to owning dyslexia and addressing the strength side because we see so much talent and there's a lot spoken about it, I think the challenge that we have are in the non English speaking markets.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: Where the narrative.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: Of the positive narrative is not there yeah exactly, and so, for example, in France, what I would love to see is that both.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: take advantage translated into French because I think there's that narrative that needs to get out there, you need to create these stepping stones and all of the non English speaking markets, they.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: translate those books I referred to earlier on, to sort of open people's mind about that, because the other thing that we haven't talked about Yet is it dyslexia is hereditary.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And you know you often find that.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: You know that it does run in families and it might skip generations and it might be, it might be an undiagnosed situation because you know 40 years ago this diagnosis wasn't happening, and so on and so forth.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: So you know it's really important that that people have this positive narrative and I think that's the first step before coming out, so to speak, and in France and other thing that is not happening that the what's happening in the Anglo Saxon world you have celebrities.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: That have dyslexia they're not necessarily coming out about it so it's almost like we need to rally the talent.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: The celebrities in each market and that's kind of like a private goal, or I should say not private but it's a personal.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: That I have open I round up the talent in France, where I live, to get them speaking because I think they will open the floodgates and people will be happy to jump on the bandwagon in a more open and transparent way.

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Neil Milliken: yeah I think that's that's a great point because you know they're all cultural differences and different different countries or different points on that journey.

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Neil Milliken: But, equally, it does take the the person or people with a bit of courage to take that first leap and say yeah i'm i'm successful but i'm also dyslexic and.

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Neil Milliken: And, and I can do some things really, really well and other things I struggle with but that doesn't make me less of a person in fact it's what what actually shapes my my attitude and my innovation, because I know that when I was undiagnosed.

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Neil Milliken: That was a challenge and so.

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Neil Milliken: There were times when I was disruptive and short Deborah was too.

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Neil Milliken: And that was I knew I was intelligent, I still failed at things and and so understanding that understanding of self that self forgiveness, is also important.

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Neil Milliken: And it gives you maybe the comfort to then encouraged to then come and come and talk about it, I also think that it's, the more you do it.

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Neil Milliken: The less difficult it becomes.

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Neil Milliken: yeah so first time I did it, it was uncomfortable.

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Neil Milliken: Now you only have to Google me, you know it will come up it's the reason to secret.

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But it takes me.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): it's almost like we.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: yeah and I think that you know it's great that you know you are so vocal about that night, you know, and I think we need other executives to come out and there needs to be some sort of a.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: Community that dyslexic it can, if let's say for the lack of a better word.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: are part of so that they can you know, there can be maybe profiles about them and encourage others, and then it just becomes a snowballing thing.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: I mean there's so many things that need to happen to get people more comfortable about talking about it but you're right, you need to start with the courage somebody like yourself encouraging other people finding well known people as well to maybe get on the bandwagon into the the.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: The the godfather the godmother of the of the movement in the given country and but yeah there needs to be something like that.

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Neil Milliken: Just so you know, there is actually a group on linkedin called neuro diverse professionals.

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Neil Milliken: So so that's one collective of people that are on a social network that open about their neuro diversity, so that it may not just be you know dyslexia, they may be, a city, they may have.

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Neil Milliken: autistic spectrum condition, but it's a it's a group of people that are professionals that are happy to talk about it and collaborate and we need more of that.

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Neil Milliken: Because that role model behavior then cascades through through the culture of the organization and gives people that maybe haven't felt comfortable permission to be open.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: yeah I agree, and maybe just to add.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): Go to no go ahead, I have a delay, just as it states here.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): And then i'll come up.

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Okay.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: I was just gonna say to that point, Neil, you know because of those cultural differences, I mean a company like yours or mine.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: who have offices all over the world, if you had a couple offices really being you know gung Ho about speaking up and out about it.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: It could encourage the executives from the French office and the German office and the Italian office extended etc, etc, so there's a certain.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: power, I think that the big corporations have so even if culturally like in France there's always sort of a stigma about making spelling mistakes.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And you know, there could be people that just do that because they are dyslexic that people would dare speak up, but if you had somebody in another office that an executive that was willing to speak up this could have a knock on effect.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): And I will also say I don't think this is just for executives and leaders, we all need to come out and really embrace our lived experiences and and I know that it's harder.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): In certain cultures that haven't really talked about this show, but I think we should not just be encouraging leaders and executives to come out, we need to encourage everybody to be their their true self, and I know that takes time and effort but.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): I also think that during this coven I know in the states, people with disabilities, especially people with hidden and invisible disabilities have not wanted to disclose that they have.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): These disabilities, because they've been seen as negative, but what we've seen during the coven 19 is more American self identifying.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): than ever before, and then we're also there's these I don't know what to think about this, but there's these weird things that are happening that.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): I can always find something positive about any situation it's almost a noxious but.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): I was talking to somebody in the UK, the other day, and they told me that they had a CEO of.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): One of their client companies that came and said, will you give me a test for dyslexia, because I want to be neuro diverse, so I thought.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): Okay that's weird wow OK, but so is being dyslexic or neuro diverse now the cool thing to be I mean you've got.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): grid a third Borg, I mean you've got the the famous Neil milliken you know what I mean so it's like Richard Branson but at the same time, even though that particular point was weird.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): I think people really need to come out and be who they are, and let's talk about our lived experiences, because, as we all have been saying, during this program.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): There is real value to the employers if you're looking at only from the lens of employment.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): retention promotion because it's great to hire somebody that's dyslexic but you need to understand who they are, you need to accommodate them make sure they can.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): thrive and be innovative and creative, because what you'll do if you hire people with dyslexia, and you ignore.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): Their true selves you do not let them really be as innovative and creative as they could be so I applaud companies like a toast that.

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Debra Ruh (she/her/hers): understand the value that Neil brings to the table, and you know really allow him, you know to once again bring his true self to the table and I don't know if you wanted to comment on that Jim but then they after you comment that we can turn it over to Antonia.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: yeah I mean, I completely agree, you know talk about the executives, but of course it needs to trickle down everybody needs to feel comfortable.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And I think it is a cultural thing too, I know, in the UK, I had different levels coming to me and feeling rather confident about that, but I don't think that's the case in every market.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: But it needs to be across the board, and you know if we could.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: You know the way I look at my initiative, and in any company, for that matter, if we really were to leverage the dyslexics imagine what we could come up with you know if we could put those dyslexics together and a think tank for the company.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: To to brainstorm about ideas and how to make the product services, you know more exciting and an easier, I mean, I think we can come up with great things and it's not just the leaders at the top, and in fact.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: You know what they what they say is that you know dyslexics tend to be in a position that's underperforming their abilities right, so we need to unleash that.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: We need to really unleash that and the first step to your point Deborah I think is for them to admit that they have this dyslexia, then they have permission to to make a mistake when the spell or be a slow reader or you know all of those other things that are outcomes about.

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Antonio Santos: So, looking at the at the workforce, looking at employment we were we have been talking about leaders, but sometimes you know our people in new and resources, they are the one doing the interviews, they are the one writing the requirements for employment.

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Antonio Santos: Option know let's say your son is growing is in schools and education system, but there are many people out there that are applying for a job and they end up in the switch in the situation where.

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Antonio Santos: The current system and the current process of human resources, might become a kind of a gate for them that can stop them from getting a job so i'll do you see.

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Antonio Santos: This and what are the steps that organizations, need to take to make sure that they don't exclude people just right just because they have read an email or a CV and you realize oh this person doesn't qualify because there's some mistakes yeah i'll do you see this.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: Well, I mean that's a great point and I think this is also something will take time at companies, but clearly I think policies need to be revisited I think that.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: there's first of all, they need to be informed you know what are they learning differences.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: What are the consequences of the where can we help them, and once people are enlightened about these things they tend to look at the.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: These learning problems as Okay, no it's just like wearing glasses right, I mean Thank God for glasses right all four of us wear glasses.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: If we didn't have glasses, we would not be able to read or do anything that well right so it's suddenly it just normal, so I think it's the same thing letting HR know about all these things.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: And the other thing is make sure that the tools are in place for those individuals, so I mean I read recently that you know.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: Having a double screen two screens, for your computer is actually a good accommodations for some dyslexics I didn't know that.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: But that should be you know just part of the toolkit and, in fact.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: We come back to the whole inclusive thing it's supposed to be the toolkit they offer anybody right it's not just the dyslexic or the learning.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: You know the person with the learning disability is actually every employee and some might find that, then you double screen.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: Regardless of the dyslexic or not so it's providing those tools and you know, and I think is another thing that we can we really can do is that we can write into the policies for the employees of the dyslexics certain things like time off because, as a parent of a dyslexic I am constantly.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: having to deal with meetings and going to meet with specialist and this down the other thing which has been easy to do.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: relatively speaking, at my level, because I have team, but for people lower in the hierarchy it's not that easy, so I think there's a lot that needs to happen in different spaces and all that, together, could lead to.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: You know, taking people on that you know okay there's a spelling mistake and maybe they're going to be less critical when they find out they're not actually to be as a result, with dyslexia.

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Neil Milliken: Excellent.

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Neil Milliken: I think we pretty much hit the end of our allotted half an hour it's been a great conversation I fully agree that we need to do more to support.

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Neil Milliken: individuals and, by the way, i've got three monitors marvelously.

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Neil Milliken: also want to thank the people that keep us on air Barclays access Michael ink and my career tech for helping us be captioned and inclusive, thank you very much journey it's been a real pleasure we're looking forward to you joining us on Twitter on Tuesday.

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Neil Milliken: And Deborah disappeared is due to the snowstorm just cutter Internet, so I think wonder why it went is it's not because she disliked our company it's it's due to the flaky connection.

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Joan Bohan -  Disney  - Paris/France: was being applied on my end looking very forward to next Tuesday.