Empowering Communities with Inclusive Sports Events

Paralympian and trailblazer Sophia Warner joins us to share how she's reshaping the landscape of inclusive sports with the Superhero Series. With events like Winter Wonder Wheels and Superhero triathlon, Sophia is breaking down barriers by allowing participants to tackle courses in any way they can—whether being towed, pushed, or using other adaptive methods. Her passion for creating a safe and inclusive space for individuals with disabilities stems from her own experiences and fuels the series' mission to enable everyone to enjoy sports without the constraints of traditional rules.

We explore the dynamic blend of disability, adventure, and empowerment that defines these groundbreaking events. Sophia’s innovative approach bridges the gap between elite Paralympic sports and broader participation, offering both live and remote opportunities for those who might face travel or sensory challenges. Supported by major sponsors like Marvel and Disney, the Superhero Series is more than just a set of events; it's a movement that champions diversity, enabling participants to showcase their abilities to the world.

Beyond the races, there’s a deeper story unfolding—a narrative of community building and support for families with disabled children. Sophia reveals how the series creates a space for connection, understanding, and shared joy, enhancing the sense of unity among participants. As the Superhero Series grows from its humble beginnings to hosting thousands, the call for continued financial and volunteer support becomes crucial. Join us in celebrating the extraordinary spirit of these events and consider being part of this inspiring journey towards a more inclusive and joyful sporting future.

Chapters

• 0:00 Inclusive Adapted Sports Events for Disabilities
• 9:55 Empowering Inclusive Sporting Events
• 17:12 Building Community Through Inclusive Sporting Events
• 26:49 Raising Funds for Inclusive Sporting Events

Transcript

Neil Milliken: 0:00

Hello and welcome to Acces Chat. I'm delighted that we're joined today by Sophia Warner, who is a Paralympian and founder of the Superhero Series. Sophia, welcome, please tell us a little bit about the Superhero Series and what it is. I know, but our audience probably doesn't, and I'm sure they're going to be really interested in the inclusive attitude to sport that you're bringing. So welcome.

Sophia Warner: 0:30

Yeah, okay, so I founded the Superior Series in 2017, and it's disability sports events, mass participation events specifically and only exclusively for people with disabilities and their friends and families. And so when I say disabilities, people traditionally always think of things wheelchair users and what have you, but actually it's any disability. So about 70% of our participants have invisible disabilities, so it includes long-term illness. Our youngest participant is 18 months and our oldest is 85. So it really is just mass participation, with all rules and regulations taken out.

Neil Milliken: 1:16

So when you say you've taken out all the rules, what do people have to do to participate?

Sophia Warner: 1:22

Okay, so we have two main events a year in person. One of them is just coming up now. It's called winter wonder wheels and for that one it's a 1k, 5k or 10k, any which way you can. So we have two paths that run parallel to one another, one of which you can walk or run or be pushed on, so you're going at walking speed, and on the other path, you can use this for adapted cycles and power chairs. So, uh, so literally anything goes.

Sophia Warner: 1:51

So when I say rules and regulations are taken out, people can push, people can be pushed. But actually the other main event in-person event is superhero try, which has already been and gone in the summer. So that includes a swim component. And when I say rules are taken out, a lot of our participants get towed in boats for the swim stage. So it's our take on a triathlon.

Sophia Warner: 2:12

It's called superhero try and people think it means superhero triathlon, but it actually means three events. So you typically and this isn't the ruling you have a team of three people, one person person does the swim, one does the bike, one does the run, and we would typically see a family take it on as a team, a family team or a school take it on as a team. So I know, for example, the mum does the swim, the dad does the bike and all three of them would come and do the run push stage together. But in order for people to be able to do as much as they want in the rules to be removed, we have people being towed in boats for the swim, pushed for the run stage and pulled along on the bike stage. So literally anything goes.

Debra Ruh: 2:55

Sophie, welcome to the program. I love what you're doing and I think it's really cool you're a Paralympian as well. What you're doing and I think it's really cool. You're a Paralympian as well. So congratulations on that. You, um, you're very, very proud of our Paralympians, Very proud. So I you know what the thing that I love about it? I love that you've made it a family event and I love that everybody's included.

Debra Ruh: 3:17

I also always personally wanted to do triathlon. Um, just never did it. It. I'm not sure I'm going to do it now, but triathlons can be very dangerous at the same time, and I know that's part of the excitement of doing a triathlon. But I love how you have done it in a way that it is really encouraging the family come out or people to come out almost as a tribe, to be included, and that I just feel I haven't seen in other groups, and so do you mind just exploring a little bit about that? I mean, it's a brilliant idea, but we haven't really seen that. I haven't seen that in the regular triathlons. So I was just curious if I've missed it or if you were really amazing, which I think is the that. That's the answer.

Sophia Warner: 4:09

Yeah, no, you know what You're, you're absolutely right and that um. So, even though I'm a Paralympian, my background is as 200 meter runner, so triathlon is not my thing. But I took part in the London triathlon back in 96. And I was the first person with a disability to cross over the finish line. And actually that's what. That's where this island, this idea, came to me because I felt really excluded, and it wasn't their fault. I have cerebral palsy, so I couldn't get my bike down from the rack by myself and I had to ask someone to help me as they were going past and I couldn't get my wetsuit off. It's that kind of thing that people don't think of, and I didn't think of it because I was just doing it for fun, but trying to get your wetsuit off with one hand, and I just thought to myself it doesn't have to be this difficult. So when? So there's things that, exactly as you say, triathlon can be dangerous, but what we've done, so for the swim section, our swim safety team is one-on-one, so we have someone on a canoe next to every single person in the water. We also have a ruling that everybody who goes in the water has to wear a wetsuit, and that's if you're disabled or non-disabled, and the reason for that is so they have extra buoyancy. But one of the best bits of feedback we get is that no one has ever been in open water before.

Sophia Warner: 5:27

The people who are doing the event have that feeling of being in a really iconic venue, because Dawning Lake, which is where it's sited, is where the Olympic and Paralympic rowing was. So when people turn up to take part, they see this amazing venue and they can't quite believe that we're going to make it possible for them to go in there. So we have this amazing swim safety team and then on top of that we have a ramp that we have designed ourselves, because what I wanted to do was make it possible for people to get themselves in and out of the water, because I don't want people to help me If I can get out. I want to get themselves in and out of the water, because I don't want people to help me, I want, if I can get out, I want to get myself out. So we have a swim safety team of sidekicks which are our volunteers, and we have something like 40 or 50 people down by the water side, and the funny thing is it's normally the non-disabled people that want to help out of the water because everyone else will drag themselves in or out. However, they do it because they just want to do it themselves.

Sophia Warner: 6:26

And then, for the bike section, we work with a company called get cycling, who offer adapted cycles, and we have the most amazing contraptions there. Some of them don't even look like bikes. They are bikes with wheelchair platforms on the back. So we find a way to do everything. We say there's no cut off times and there's no restrictions, and whatever you take, as long as you want, um, and we'll find a way of getting you around. Sophie, how do you?

Debra Ruh: 6:52

is it? Is it a typical um sorry, I have a bunch of questions and I know that in but is it a typical um, like experience and in that it's timed, so the person that's going to win, okay, cool, cool. Only because it's like if I'm struggling because of my disability to get my wetsuit off, you know, it seems like that should not be. I shouldn't be penalized for that and I understand the realities of it, but I was. I was just curious how you did that.

Sophia Warner: 7:26

And then I know, and you know what, I've been on the receiving end of that and actually, you know, within paralympic sport we are lucky in some ways in that we're classified. So you know, for example, I'm a t35 and I know that you know there's a there's a quite a big variable within the t35, but I know that when I get on the track as an elite athlete, a very long time ago everyone in my race would also be a T35. You know, we can't do that because what we have is we have people who have autism taking part alongside somebody who had a rugby injury and is paralyzed from the jaw downwards. So to give people timing, you know, and that person's being carried around by his eight team members who are not paralyzed. So you know, we can't give people timing. But what we do have is we have people come back and be the best version of themselves and they often time themselves. You'll see on social media people saying I'm four seconds faster than I was last year.

Sophia Warner: 8:24

But we that I can tell you every year, at every single event, a guy that will win is a guy called sam wholeness. You should look him up. He's the first person with autism to do an iron man and he now holds the world record. But he comes in, he smashes it and then we have people with exoskeleton suits. Suits take four and a half hours to do 5K. You know there's no timing. We'd love to interview him. Oh, you really should. I should introduce you. He's amazing. Please, please, please. Yes, he's amazing.

Antonio Santos: 8:56

So, sofia, if we look at the people who participate, can you tell us stories of why do they do it, why do they go into this adventure and participate in the event?

Sophia Warner: 9:12

I think the same reason why I put it on, because first and foremost, we're the only one in the world that is exclusively for people with disabilities, and so I think there's this feeling that people want inclusion and I personally want to be on my own. I want to prove to other people like myself that I'm the best out of what I could possibly be. I don't want to be included in a mainstream event and come last. So I think people come because it's a safe environment to be amongst other people like themselves and be the best they can be, without people staring, without people asking questions. I think if you were to talk to people who've come to Superhero Series since our first one, they come back year after year and they all just feel safe in that environment.

Antonio Santos: 9:55

I think sometimes we talk with some of our friends and people who participate on Access Chat and some of them say well, the fact that I have a disability doesn't mean I don't want to do a radical thing or I don't want to experience radical things. So how do you see this event? Changing perspectives on the people who surround the event and to see the event could be online, or it could be just watching everything happening while it goes.

Sophia Warner: 10:32

Yeah, that's a really good point actually. So there's a couple of things on that. Firstly, the whole event is subsidized by sponsors. Yeah, that's a really good point actually. So there's a couple of things on that first, firstly, the whole event is subsidized by sponsors and, um, I think it speaks, I mean, literally. So last year we gifted 60 of our places completely for free and the rest of them are heavily subsidized.

Sophia Warner: 10:49

And I think it's really powerful that marvel stroke, disney have headlined our event for the last seven years and they are still headlining for another four. And the reason for that is because they use it as their D&I initiative, their sole D&I initiative, to demonstrate firsthand to their colleagues what's possible when you have a disability. So their, their colleagues come along every year as our sidekick volunteers and we have 100% retention of all of our super partners. We work with Pfizer, zurich, we work with some amazing brands who all see this as best in class when it comes to disability inclusion. So I think it does really demonstrate what's possible, and that's people who are on looking and then people who have the disabilities themselves. They're proving to themselves what they can achieve because they have a lot of them, first of all, haven't had the opportunity. Secondly, they do want to do it, but where do you go? I mean, I know there's nowhere else to go. And thirdly, once you've done it once, why wouldn't you just come back and see if you can do it a little bit quicker?

Debra Ruh: 11:50

You know, Sophia, you made me. Whenever Antonio asked that question, he always asked good questions. It made me think of my daughter with Down syndrome, and Sarah is 37 years old and she's walked some tough path, just like all of us, but she is such an adventurer. She does things I would never do. For example, we went into okay, I'm scared of heights, so I chickened out in Costa Rica on the zip line, not Sarah.

Debra Ruh: 12:18

Sarah went to a big theme park in the United States and she did a parachute jump, which I was terrified and I didn't want her to do it and I was like I did with all my mother ability. I did not want her to do it, but she wanted to, so I I did get out of the way and let her do it. I was terrified, but people were just amazed watching her. People were just amazed, and so I think you're right. People want to show. We want to show what we're made of, and don't assume we can't do something, because so I think this is so powerful. How long have you been doing it? How many years?

Sophia Warner: 12:55

Yeah, our first event was in 2017. And no, you're absolutely right, but I think I think there's an easy thing to do in the disabled community and the non-disabled community, and that is to assume that everybody's the same. So there will be people who don't like sport in the disabled community, but you know there's 16 million people in the UK living with a disability, so we can pretty much assume that there will be the same percentage of those guys that do want to throw themselves into Dorney Lake and that don't. So, you know, why not give them the opportunity? So, yeah, our first event was in 2017 and then when the pandemic hit, obviously we, like everybody, had to sort of change things around quite a lot.

Sophia Warner: 13:36

But actually we'd already been in conversations with some of our super partners about the amount of feedback we were getting from superheroes about the fact that they couldn't travel to Dorney Lake or that they didn't like crowds and didn't like noise, and did we have a quiet race, you know, like for people with autism and such like?

Sophia Warner: 13:55

And our event doesn't really match quiet, and so we'd already had an idea to take the event remotely, to have an event called At Home. So we launched At Home Superheroes and we now since 2020, we've been running two of those a year alongside our live event and for all of those superheroes, we send them a race pack with a finish line tape, a medal and a T-shirt, and they all run them from within their schools and communities and that's proven to be a huge success as well. So I think during the pandemic, that went to 11,000 people and they did it from their homes, gardens and local communities, and we're still running those events alongside our events now, and we run them into SEN schools predominantly, but it means that there's absolutely no one, because I wanted to always say that we were 100% inclusive and now I can, because included into that event we have super sensory. So I guess in in total, we have four events a year I think it.

Neil Milliken: 14:58

It's great that that, as someone that has come from elite sport, you recognize the the need and the benefit of mass participation because the the paralympics is very much an elite sport event and you know it's quite easy to, as a couch potato, feel excluded from that and as a person that has a disability but wouldn't qualify under the Paralympic classifications, you know it's an interesting gap that you've closed.

Sophia Warner: 15:47

It's a huge gap and it's massively frustrating. And you know I feel very privileged to be from the old school Paralympics where my being a Paralympian came from my absolute love of sport. You know I was born in the 70s and there was no such thing as disability sport. You just kind of had to crack on with it and so I wasn't somebody who was part of the. I competed in London, which was obviously phenomenal, but up until that stage I only had 20 people in the crowd when I used to compete. So that's why I've done this for mass participation, because that's where I was born, into mass participation. I got spotted running a 10k, so you know I saw the gap firsthand.

Sophia Warner: 16:43

Yeah, and I think that even if you don't love sport, you can love events that are about people and coming together, and you know as much as we love watching Park Run and all of these amazing events unfold when you have a disability. It's not necessarily the problem that you become last or that you can't take part. It's the fact that everybody stares at you. So we all know the biggest barrier to sport is confidence, and so I think that's what the superhero series delivers is confidence to people.

Antonio Santos: 17:12

Sophia, is it fair to say that you somehow created a community around this?

Sophia Warner: 17:17

Yeah, definitely, if you could go online and see the families that we have taken part. So I can think of lots of children who started when they were three, who are now I can't do the math, but they're now 11 or 12. But it's not really just about them. It's about their parents, who are meeting other parents who have children with the same disabilities. There's always one little girl that I refer to who has a disability. That only I think it's 180 children in the whole world have this chromosome disability her name's Eve. And then they found another family and now four of them take part in the event. It's amazing. So they come along with their parents and do the event and it's great because those families get to talk about.

Sophia Warner: 18:00

You know some of these disabilities, especially with rare diseases. You don't meet anybody who has the same thing and you can't talk to other parents about what the prognosis is, and so, yeah, I think the communities that we've built aren't just about the participants. Sometimes it's about just bringing people together to have a really good chat. And the other community that I think we've been really good for is the service people. So we work very closely with Invictus and Help for Heroes, and what we found out from them was that they often take part in sporting events themselves, but their wives or husbands or children don't get to be part of their rehab, whereas the superhero series they all get to do something together, which I think is really powerful as well.

Debra Ruh: 18:46

Yeah, I think it's really important to bring the families together in a different way. Now this is a silly point, but I was in Walmart yesterday and they have these Christmas pajamas or holiday pajamas for the whole family yeah, the parents, the kids and I looked at it and I thought that's so silly, but I thought but also sort of sweet right.

Neil Milliken: 19:07

Yeah.

Debra Ruh: 19:09

Because you know it's interesting to be a family, especially a family with a child with a more severe disability and I agree with what you said, sophia. The reality is being able to talk to other families that are dealing with the same thing that you're dealing with. It is a gift. It is a gift. Yeah, you just can't. It's hard for other people to understand, and sometimes other people just get overwhelmed and almost feel so sorry for you that you don't have the impact either. Just even little silly things, like when my daughter got very sick and gained so much weight all at once within two months, just the way society was treating her, you know, like she can't control her eating, when it was absolutely had nothing to do with eating. Being able to talk to other families that have experienced that, it's been a gift to me, and I also find that, as my beautiful daughter continues to grow into adulthood, that sometimes it's a little bit more challenging for us as families.

Debra Ruh: 20:10

And so yeah, I just think it's so important to do what you're doing and bring the families together. That is a byproduct, but it's a powerful byproduct for us families.

Sophia Warner: 20:22

Yeah definitely and I've definitely seen firsthand because I have children of my own now and I now realize that my parents probably found it harder than I did now that I've got children, because it's much harder to deal with something for your kids than it is to deal with it by yourself I agree I think most of the parents that bring their children along drag their kids along to do the events so they can be there.

Sophia Warner: 20:44

But you know, you see them pushing their children along in boats and like pulling them on bikes, and I've seen kids that are asleep while their parents are doing the event. So I think you're right, I think it is more about the family than themselves. Also, you know, I mustn't sort of steer away from the fact that we also because our winter event coincides with International Day of Disability we have lots of organizations that are partners or corporate friends of ours who come and celebrate their International Day of Disability there with all of their D&I networks, because why wouldn't you celebrate your disability on that day? So we have quite a lot of corporates come along and take on the event in december and you watch them all struggling around and having a bit of a giggle at the end and celebrating. In what way better than just by dressing up as a superhero and trying to run 5k?

Neil Milliken: 21:33

it's fantastic and and you know you've you've got all of these corporations involved in the uk any ambition to to go beyond our shores and yeah, you know yeah, sort of do you know what?

Sophia Warner: 21:51

I'm really a big believer in doing something really really well, and I think if the pandemic hadn't hit, I might have looked to try and do so. I love our events as they are. They're really good that we filled. Superhero tribe was full for the first time this year. Winter wonderworlds is looking really busy and I've, and we we have had some approaches. You know we looked at disneyland, paris actually, for um was to work with disney and I think really it's about find.

Sophia Warner: 22:18

For me, holding the superhero ethos to its full extent is really important. So I have to find venues that are completely flat, so no one has to pay for parking, so that people don't have to worry about using their day chair, because one of the things with the no rules and no regulations is that most of our participants don't have access to racing wheelchairs or or super running blades. So I have to find a venue where people can take as long as they want and they don't need anything. So if I could find somewhere that enabled superheroes to unleash their superpowers to their full extent, then I would do it. But so far beyond um, where we've found that is, that's been as far as we've got.

Neil Milliken: 23:02

I mean, maybe the Netherlands is pretty darn flat yeah, you're right.

Sophia Warner: 23:07

Yeah, definitely, they've got plenty of bikes there, for sure yeah, yeah.

Neil Milliken: 23:12

No, but it's a good point. I mean, I think maintaining the quality and the ethos of the event is really important and more important than just sort of going out and cookie-cuttering.

Debra Ruh: 23:24

Yeah, yeah, and that's usually when you start seeing people. Fail too is when they try to grow it too quickly. I'm thinking of, you know, restaurants, you know it seems like they're good, and then they start getting too many and right.

Sophia Warner: 23:42

So yeah, and anyone who works with me will tell you I'm a complete control freak about the brand and I'm not just talking about how it looks, I'm talking about you know, if someone just said the wrong thing to someone with a disability, used the wrong thing to someone with a disability, used the wrong language, did something that someone couldn't do, it didn't put a ramp up in the right place, I don't believe it's something that you can franchise and trust someone unless they have a disability themselves.

Antonio Santos: 24:07

To put it, to make it like it is, so, if you look to the events, to the families and the people participating, what have you observed in terms of change of behavior or in benefits for those who have joined?

Sophia Warner: 24:27

Oh, wow, this is such another really good question. Do you know what? It's? The confidence I see and it's what I hear back from the parents and you know.

Sophia Warner: 24:35

So there's, there's, there's so much I could say about the event, but, um, one of the things I'm really proud of is is our collateral. So we had them. Our t-shirts are amazing quality, like we literally don't scrimp on anything we do, and our medals are, because I came fourth in the Paralympics which we don't need to talk about but I didn't get a medal, and so I modeled our medals for the superhero series on a Paralympics which we don't need to talk about, but I didn't get a medal, and so I modelled our medals for the Superhero Series on a Paralympic medal. So they are five millimetres thick and they are massive. I mean, they're massive. They're so big that we have to put Velcro on the back for health and safety reasons, but it's that kind of thing. So the people who win the medals, especially the children, they all take them into school the next day to show. So it's that kind of sense of pride of having achieved something really big.

Neil Milliken: 25:21

So I think the thing that we see mostly in the people who've done it is, first of all, a kind of a sense of belief they couldn't quite believe they achieved it, because it's huge and then, secondly, just a sense of pride and the desire to come back and do it again and I think you know building confidence and building pride and a sense of self-achievement is is really important when you face so much exclusion and so much innate prejudice in society that it's really great to be able to create an event where there is cohesion and people feel confident enough to even start and attempt it, and when they complete, then what you've done is really ramp up that confidence even more. So what percentage would you say of your participants come back year after year, because it sounds like it's pretty high.

Sophia Warner: 26:17

I would say that if people can come back, they do come back year after year, because it sounds like it's it's pretty high. I would say that if people can come back, they do come back, and so I can't give you an exact number, but I would be very surprised if someone who does it this year doesn't do it next year. So I mean to give you an idea of the size of us. We only have some two and a half people who work here full time. We're still, you know, we're not managed to grow as anywhere near as big as I would like, and so, um, everything we do is organic. So we don't have a marketing budget, we don't have a spend, so I would say that everything we've achieved has been purely by word of mouth, so that sort of speaks for itself.

Sophia Warner: 26:49

So we start. The first year we did superhero try. We had about 500 people there, and this year we had 5 000 people. Wow. And we've had a pandemic in the middle. Wow, we're full. We couldn't have taken any more this year.

Neil Milliken: 27:04

That's exciting so how, how? So okay, people can't participate this year, but how can people get involved if, if, if you're a family member or someone with a disability that wants to participate, how?

Sophia Warner: 27:21

do you?

Debra Ruh: 27:21

get up.

Sophia Warner: 27:23

Go to our website, wwwsuperheroeseriescouk, and you can sign up for all of next year's events and you can sign there. We've still got some spaces in winter wonder worlds, which is on the 1st of december, and then if you don't have a disability and you want to come and have a look and be a part of it, expectators are free so you can come down and have a look and be a part of it. Spectators are free, so you can come down and have a look. And if you'd like to be a volunteer, our sidekick volunteering opportunities are open for our events next year, Again with our sidekicks. That's the other thing with our volunteering.

Sophia Warner: 27:57

The organisations that we work with that we call Super Partners. They offer it to their colleagues as volunteering and we have 350 psychic volunteers for Superhero Tri, 150 for Winter Wonderworlds, and they're always full because of the opportunities you get as a volunteer. I mean, obviously we do have people helping in parking and things like that, but predominantly they are actually handson assisting people around the course. I mean it's the most amazing psychic opportunity. So that's how people can come and get involved.

Debra Ruh: 28:31

And I can send you the team and also sponsors. Let's get you more sponsors. More sponsors too. Sorry, I accidentally stepped on you. Sorry, always need more sponsors. Yeah, sorry, I accidentally stepped on you.

Sophia Warner: 28:40

We always need more sponsors. Every year, we wake up on the 1st of January and we start from scratch with a target to raise £650,000 to make the two events stick together, and it's a huge feat, but we do it year on year. But it's just yeah, and, like I say, there's two and a half of us and we just go out to people who we think are really passionate about disability.

Neil Milliken: 29:02

Yeah, and it's a tough ask because I I know that you know getting corporates to sign up to this stuff is it's not not always easy. Uh, with the best, yeah with the best one on.

Sophia Warner: 29:15

that is that we, where where I always feel confident is we have 100% retention. So once a partner comes, sees it for themselves, takes part, gets their volunteers on board. We've kept hold of the same partners we've had since the start, but it's just, you know, trying to keep up with those costs, those price rises out there and also, I think, with our community, what we're seeing is less and less people being able to pay to come and take part. So, you know, whereas we would have gifted 20% of our places, we're now gifting 60%, which is big.

Debra Ruh: 29:49

Wow, wow.

Sophia Warner: 29:51

But it's what it is and I wouldn't give it up. It is just a reality, yeah.

Debra Ruh: 29:55

Exactly, yeah, that's why we need you know important and corporate sponsors.

Neil Milliken: 30:00

So that's why we need you know important in corporate sponsors so that's why we appreciate um the corporations that support our community, and that's a good way to support it yeah, yeah and I think that we, we want to see more, uh, corporates engaging in community events and and both in terms of cash sponsorship and also in terms of volunteering. The UK is quite good in that it allows corporations to allow people to have days that they can work and volunteer, and that's something that I don't think every organization realizes that they can. You know, it's a way of enabling organizations through volunteering. Not everything has to be cash. Big companies, although everyone thinks they've got tons of money, often are very siloed, and so finding creative ways of getting those contributions, I think, is really something that… yeah, and I would definitely say it's a nice mix of the two.

Sophia Warner: 31:06

I think all the time with some things like, especially with what we do, because we're subsidising the places and the events themselves.

Sophia Warner: 31:16

cash, unfortunately, does play a massive role Of course, yeah, in addition to that, you're absolutely right our events, our events, wouldn't happen a without the participants and superheroes that first and foremost be without the psychic support and see without the the finances but needed behind it. So you know, it's trying to get that mix right, but for me, the sooner I managed to raise the funds needed for the event, I can focus on. The only reason I did this was for the superheroes, so it's nice to be able to get the get the get the kind of the court, the um, commercial side out of the way so I can focus on the fun part, which is getting the superheroes out there in their boats, on their bikes and taking part in the event. Yeah, absolutely.

Debra Ruh: 32:00

It's amazing to see it and the videos.

Sophia Warner: 32:03

It's amazing, you should come.

Debra Ruh: 32:05

I want to come. I want to come. I want Sarah to do it. I think she would love it oh yeah, absolutely, I didn't know about it. I'm so excited. Yeah, this is a really wonderful thing to do.

Neil Milliken: 32:16

Yeah, it really is.

Sophia Warner: 32:18

Thank you.

Neil Milliken: 32:18

Excellent. So I think you know I want to wish you a fantastic Winter Wander Wheels event. Look forward to. You know, sharing this with our community. Need to thank our sponsors, Amazon and MyClearText, for keeping us inclusive captioned on air. And thank you again, sophia, it's been a pleasure catching up with you.

Sophia Warner: 32:47

Yeah, you too. Thank you, so nice to see you all.